Opera Slams Microsoft’s Windows 7 E Move – Again

By Vygantas Lipskas | July 17, 2009 | 61 Comments

The Register writes:

Microsoft is continuing to insist it has gone to great lengths in recent months to appease European antitrust watchdogs by saying it will “respect the user choice of the default browser” in Windows.

However, rival browser maker Opera, which brought the original complaint about Microsoft tying its browser to its operating system to the European Commission in 2007, continues to proclaim the software giant hasn’t gone far enough yet.

[Read]


About (Author Profile)


Vygantas Lipskas is a former web designer whose projects are used by companies such as AMD, NVIDIA and departed Westood Studios. Being passionate about software, Vygantas began his journalism carrier back in 2007 when he founded FavBrowser.com. Having said that, he is also an adrenaline junkie who enjoys good books, fitness activities and Forex trading.

  • Andrew

    Seems all that Opera wants is to force Microsoft to bundle their browser with Windows. It’s your product, promote it yourself!

    • Daniel Hendrycks

      Google and Mozilla are against Microsoft in this issue also so if you are against Opera I guess you are against Google and Mozilla also

      • Luke

        Stop kidding yourself. Opera is the biggest whiner here just because nobody wants its browser.

        Wake me up when we see Mozilla, Apple and Google become as big crybabies as Opera is.

        • Flapper

          Just look up the facts, Luke. Mozilla and Google are as involved as Opera. But hypocrisy is the norm here it seems.

          • Luke

            So show me a news article that says “Mozilla/Google/Apple Cries about Microsoft’s Windows 7E Move – Again”. Oh wait, you can’t. Not that Mozilla/Google/Apple need to resort to this kind of childishness; they’re busy making browsers that people actually want to install and use.

            And when the facts get pointed out for what they are, the Opera fanboys cry even louder, “boo hoo we’re getting picked on for being crybabies”. Go figure.

          • Flapper

            How about you show me the articles that say “Opera Cries about Microsoft’s Windows 7E Move – Again”?

            Oh, you can’t? Why is that? Is it because you are inventing stuff and willfully ignoring facts that don’t match your bigotry?

            It isn’t my fault that you haven’t seen all the comments from Google and Mozilla. But it does show your extreme hypocrisy and ignorance. It’s only bad if Opera does it, right?

          • Flapper

            BTW, Luke, here’s how the article you lied about title for ends:

            “All of which prompts us to ask the question: why didn’t Microsoft have that option in place before now?”

          • Luke

            Congratulations on showing everyone how you’re either blind or being willfully ignorant. You want an article about how hard poor Flopera is crying, you’re looking right at it.

            So go ahead. Show us an article that tells how Mozilla/Apple/Google are whining about Microsoft’s actions. Back up your pathetic attempt to deflect the blame to other browser vendors with some real evidence, not just talk. Oh wait, that’s right, I forgot… you can’t. That’s why, despite all your tough talk, we haven’t seen any from you.

          • Flapper

            In other words, Luke is more into trolling than actually substantiating his claims. He claimed that there were articles about Opera “crying”, and all he could point to was the article this blog post already linked to where they author actually agrees with Opera.

            Gotta love trolls.

          • Luke

            Gotta love how the Opera ph4nboiz continue playing the deflect-the-blame game without being able to offer the slightest shred of proof. Here’s some reality for you: not all browser makers produce crappy products like Opera, nor are they so lame as to resort to crying to the EU to have Microsoft advertise their crappy product for them.

            The author “agrees” with Opera? Opera ph4nboiz elevate the art of shoving one’s head up their rear end to an entirely new level. Microsoft is doing this now because of the EU, and it’s an open secret that the EU considers Microsoft its personal piggy bank to be fined at will over the most ridiculous of excuses. The EU being retarded means Opera is right? Oh wow.

          • Flapper

            Ignorance is bliss. This troll apparently didn’t get the part where both Google and Mozilla joined the complaint.

            It’s also hilarious that these Microsoft shills thinks the EU is “being retarded” for enforcing its own laws, which, by the way, Microsoft fully agrees with. Microsoft has even filed antitrust complaints against other companies (Google comes to mind) in the EU (as well as in the US). And Google has filed complaints against Microsoft, by the way.

            I guess that means everyone produces nothing but garbage. Or is the MS shill just another ignorant hypocrite?

            Yeah, it’s a “ridiculous excuse” to enforce a law even Microsoft supports, LOL.

          • Luke

            Looks like the Opera shills are so desperate to deflect the blame from Opera that Mozilla/Google joining in the antitrust complaint automatically means they support the solution of forcing Microsoft to advertise their products for them. Like I said, no proof yet so far to back up your talk; for the simple reason there isn’t any.

            Opera is whining loud and proud, it really puzzles me why you Opera shills on the other hand seem to be so ashamed of it.

          • Thoe

            Mozilla/Google joining in the antitrust complaint automatically means they support the solution of forcing Microsoft to advertise their products for them

            Opera isn’t forcing anyone. Like Mozilla and Google, Opera is just an “interested third party”. It’s the EC which makes the decisions.

            Oh, and if you are doubting if Google and Mozilla support forcing Microsoft to carry competitors, let’s wait and see if they decline the offer to be bundled with Windows…… If they do, you were right. If they don’t, all these complaints about Opera are nothing but hypocrisy.

          • Luke

            No, Opera isn’t “forcing” anyone. But it has been very vocal about voicing its support for the forcing. Which is the whole point, and one that the Opera shills, in their shame, try so desperately to ignore. And now Opera is actually going after the IE logo as well, oh boy.

            Are Mozilla/Google all pure and angelic in this issue? No, they’re in it for the market share as well. The big difference is that they’re nowhere as shameless and pathetic about it, which, again, is the point that the Opera shills are too ashamed to face.

          • Thoe

            But it has been very vocal about voicing its support for the forcing.

            So when a criminal breaks the law and is thrown in jail, he is “forced” to be locked up, and anyone who supports placing criminals in jail cells is being mean?

            And now Opera is actually going after the IE logo as well, oh boy.

            So you are rejecting his argument that the icon is very well known? Apparently you are more concerned with personal attacks than actually discussing the points that are made.

            Are Mozilla/Google all pure and angelic in this issue? No, they’re in it for the market share as well. The big difference is that they’re nowhere as shameless and pathetic about it

            Really? So just silently reaping the benefits without doing any hard work is just fine?

            I also don’t understand what’s “shameless and pathetic” about commenting on issues you are asked about, and sharing your opinion. Would you prefer Fascism over free speech?

            I find it interesting that you try to come up with any excuse to bash Opera while at the same time giving, say, Google a free pass. Google has actually filed antitrust complaints against other companies, but those were thrown out. But clearly, Google can do whatever it wants to, but when Opera does it, it’s “shameless whining”. Go figure.

          • Luke

            [quote]So when a criminal breaks the law and is thrown in jail, he is “forced” to be locked up, and anyone who supports placing criminals in jail cells is being mean?[/quote]
            Yeah, let’s puck more crap out of your asses and pretend Microsoft actually broke laws. That lends such a strong credence to Opera’s whining!

            [quote]So you are rejecting his argument that the icon is very well known? Apparently you are more concerned with personal attacks than actually discussing the points that are made.[/quote]
            What the hell does the icon being well-known have to do with anything? Oh wait, I know, that’s illegal as well. Oh my.

            [quote]Really? So just silently reaping the benefits without doing any hard work is just fine?[/quote]
            Hard work? Yeah, maybe that’s what pathetically shameless whining passes for at Opera. They did some real hard work to promote their browser, as opposed to what Mozilla, Google, Apple and even Microsoft have been doing. My heart’s bleeding for them indeed, poor bullied and oppressed Flopera.

      • Golden Boy

        They have just joined the party but haven’t started complain and article says its opera who whines now. Its not leaders job to promote other products

        • Flapper

          Actually, Mozilla has written extensively about this case. The “Chief Lizard Wrangler” had a long series of posts about all the evils of Microsoft, and Google’s official blog went on and on about how Microsoft messed up the market.

          But I guess it’s OK to “whine” if you are Mozilla or Google… Never mind the fact that Google has actually filed antitrust complaints against other companies (Microsoft)!

  • http://n/a R S Chan

    Opera is probably the best Browser out there. They regularly introduce new features and the other browsers have to play catch up.
    Even now after many years of trying no browser can match Opera in their ZOOM

  • http://n/a R S Chan

    OPERA is probably the best browser ever came to existence. They have regularly come up with new features and new ways to brows the Internet. They are the first one to introduce TAB browser. All the otehr browsers have been playing catch up all these year and yet still no one come close to imitate OPERA’s ZOOM feature. And OPERA’s security is the best.

    I agree that OPERA should advertise more so more people will know its superiority over all the other browsers. I advice all people over 50 (starting to need reading glasses) to try OPERA and its marvelous and inimitable ZOOM feature.

  • blaze

    Oh yes, Opera is the best to introduce new features All the other browsers are catching up. That is why ONLY in version 10 it gets a spell checker(a basic feature for many other browsers) and an proper update API so that finally users don’t have to download another full 7MB for every release(even for minor updates). The mail client is only now getting rich text and the torrent client is just useless.
    Who knows how long it will take to get private browsing in Opera. Great Opera, all the other browsers are catching up with you. One thing I do agree with you, Opera should advertise their browser more.

    • Flapper

      Opera has had a spell checker for years. It just wasn’t an inline spell checker. Spell checkers aren’t exactly a killer browser feature.

      But look at how quickly Opera’s speed dial was adopted. Even Mozilla wants to add its own speed dial implementation now.

      Opera is always leading the way and redefining browsers, and the others are borrowing heavily from them.

      • nobody

        yes, but also note how does every single one Speed dial implementation beat opera’ one. opera is good at innovation, but very, very bad at implementation. most their inventions are introduced and then left alone to die.

        • Flapper

          How do other implementations “beat” Opera’s? They are just slightly different, that’s all. Which one is better is purely subjective. Only an obsessive troll would claim otherwise.

          • nobody

            different? no. firefox addons can do what opera can do AND much more. and it looks better and is more customisable.

            it took opera 2 years to introduce something that was immediately added into ff’ extensions – being able to change number of ‘slots’.

            it is the same with every damn ‘invention’ opera does. session management? cookie editor? userJS? opera invents it, implements it badly and want the world to love it for being ‘innovative’.

            people dont care about ‘intentions’, people care about implementations, because they can use them – opera does not deliver these. most their implementations are partial, sometimes broken, and sometimes so weird that noone uses them (nicknames for bookmarks – it is a feature hidden so deep, that most opera users dont know about it).

            yes. speed dial was a nice STARTING POINT. other vendors went ahead and unleashed full potential of ‘blank page’. opera’ one looks really dull right now

            as for the MS vs Opera case. it is Opera’ right to complain if they feel violated in any way. thats the law. however dont be surprised when people call you whiner or crybaby. because on one hand opera is fighting for the ‘greater good’ on the other, opera desperately need good/bad/any press coverage and marketshare. lawsuit is their way to do it. and no, Unite didnt work as a coverage, most reactions were ‘huh?’ others were ‘wtf? security?’ and now is ‘it isnt reliable and we dont trust it will ever be, and we dont need it anyway’. Unite isnt a revolution opera wanted it to be, and press certainly noticed this. more luck next time.

          • Flapper

            Firefox addons are third party software bolted on as an afterthought, sadly.

            Opera’s Speed Dial is perfect for most people’s use.

            lawsuit is their way to do it

            Opera didn’t sue Microsoft, ignorant troll. Opera filed a complaint, which was then supported by both Google and Mozilla. But I guess it’s only bad when Opera does it!

            By the way, Microsoft has filed antitrust complaints against Google in the US and EU, and vice versa. But again I guess that if you are an insane, obsessive troll it’s only bad if it’s Opera doing it :D

            Wow, you Microsoft shills sure are ignorant.

          • Andrew

            @Flapper
            Bad here is not filling complaint but keep insisting that the only possible solution is the one you want and ignoring others. Such behavior only shows one’s weakness.

            (Sorry for my English)

          • Thoe

            Bad here is not filling complaint but keep insisting that the only possible solution is the one you want and ignoring others. Such behavior only shows one’s weakness.

            So any solution Microsoft suggests is automatically a good suggestion, and Opera is being evil for not accepting just anything Microsoft throws at them?

            By the way, Opera is not the authority here. They are just a third party. It’s the EC that runs the case.

      • Foo

        Not having a blank new tab page is not the same as “implementing” a dial…

        • Flapper

          Yeah, I’m sure it is pure coincidence that everyone is doing it now :D

          • Foo

            It’s been 2 years since they added the dial page, how long should it go before it suddenly turns into a coincidence? There has hardly been any updates to it since then even.

            Wanting to use the empty space that is a new tab is hardly new, some of the earliest requests on Mozilla’s Bugzilla were about populating a new window/tab with content/metadata:
            https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=200956
            https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18808

            You could probably find more in the forums.

            Aza Raskin is probably the employee (from what I’ve seen) who pushes the most for using the empty tab somehow.
            http://www.azarask.in/blog/post/new-tabs/
            Yes he mentions the dial in a passing, but that is hardly his source of inspiration.

            New Tab King is the closest implementation of what he’s talking about, from what I’ve seen.
            … I also have to mention Auto Dial 3D, while I think it’s worthless, it’s a pretty nice concept.

            Myself, I prefer to have a blank black page, so much nicer and cleaner.

          • Flapper

            It’s very obvious that Opera’s Speed Dial once again led the way. Just like they were first with popup blocking, the search field, etc.

          • Foo

            Are you ignorant or just plain blind? How the heck do you “lead the way” by adding a tiny bit of wysiwyg to the default new tab page???

            *notices that I’m the only one in the comments even taking an extra 10 seconds to find third-party information*

            For the rest, I’ll refer you to this thread:
            http://www.favbrowser.com/opera-we-will-reinvent-the-web/comment-page-1/#comment-61946

          • Flapper

            Of course an anti-Opera troll who spends all day trolling about Opera will claim that anything Opera does is basically nothing.

            Rational people, however, realize that Opera pioneered Speed Dial, and the rest are falling in line behind them now. And that is only in addition to all the other things Opera pioneered.

          • Foo

            How exactly do you translate “taking 1-10minutes of my free time occasionally to answer people’s comments” into “Spending all day trolling”?? (Yes, I do consider you a person too)

            How can they “pioneer” in creating a simple web-page?

            By the way, I would really like to see you come up with something other than personal slander some day…

          • Flapper

            Speed Dial is not a web page. It’s a visual list of sites of your choosing.

            Funny that an ignorant MS shill who conveniently ignores Google’s antitrust complaints against MS and vice versa talks about “personal attacks”… :D

          • Foo

            Ok, adding “web” in front of it were an accident. Good to see though that that’s the only thing you disagreed with :)

            Perhaps you’re too ignorant to notice but I don’t give a damn about this whole antitrust spectacle.
            Well, except that most things hurting Microsoft is good for the world of open-source ;)

            Also, you might want to take note of some other things:
            One antitrust complaint is not the same as another. Just like being on trial for accused rape is not the same as being on trial for accused littering.

            Google and Mozilla are on this whole thing as something called “interested third party”, which basically means that they are allowed to submit comments to the court and participate in some classified information. Which I don’t find strange, they both are browser-makers after all and have had previous encounters with Microsoft.

            The comments made by members of Google and Mozilla were, from what I can remember of the things I’ve read, personal and not an official position of either organization.
            I don’t know where you are, but not being allowed to hold a personal opinion about something sounds harsh to me.

          • Foo

            Btw, I forgot to ask. How is personal attacks related to an organization going to court to settle an argument with another organization?

          • Thoe

            One antitrust complaint is not the same as another.

            Sounds about right. Unlike Opera’s complaint, Google and Microsoft’s were thrown out because they had no merit. Opera’s complaint did have merit.

            Google and Mozilla are on this whole thing as something called “interested third party”, which basically means that they are allowed to submit comments to the court and participate in some classified information.

            That’s the same status as Opera.

            The comments made by members of Google and Mozilla were, from what I can remember of the things I’ve read, personal and not an official position of either organization.

            Both Google and Mozilla made official statements. The Mozilla boss dedicated several blog posts in her own blog to the subject over a period of time.

    • Grrblt

      No one said that Opera invented *all* browser features.

      • Flapper

        Not only did Opera not invent anything, but they suck at everything they do and can never do anything right. On the other hand, Microsoft, Google and Mozilla always do things right and are perfect, and always super innovative.

        Remember, Opera is always crap no matter what happens. Who cares about facts anyway?

  • blah

    @blaze:

    seriously? Opera had a spell checker since a long long time ago, and I can’t even remember for how long. It just did not underline errors like in a word processor.

    • Andrew

      “Opera had a spell checker, it just did not underline errors”

      It summarizes precisely why Opera sucks.

      • Lucy

        “It summarizes precisely why Opera sucks.”

        And this summarizes how this blog is infested with trolls.

      • Flapper

        Yeah, all of Opera sucks because of one tiny and irrelevant thing. That’s the way of the troll.

        • Andrew

          Tiny – yes, but not irrelevant.

          After all it was only example. And nice summary of what nobody said.

          • Flapper

            Epic fail. No one ever claimed that Opera came up with spell checking.

          • Andrew

            Do you want to trick me to install Opera to check it?

            http://www.opera.com/browser/tutorials/spellcheck/ – will it underline errors after doing that?

          • Foo

            @Flappr
            As I understand it, Andrew commented on Opera’s apparent lacking ability when it comes to fully implement something. Instead you, if I read it correctly, end up with a feature that is just partially completed.
            In the case of spell-checking, it were about it not happening automatically when you write and that you instead have to manually tell the browser to do it.

            Also, yeah, you’re right about you being the only one mentioning anything about “opera came up with spell-checking”, or did I miss something? Though, I guess that depends on how you interpret Blah’s comment.

          • Foo singing opera ;P

            @Andrew
            I can confirm that this bug has been fixed in v10 at least. Hooray for progress!
            There’s actually one thing that other browser makers might want to add: “remove word from dictionary”
            I personally don’t have any use for it, though I could see how others might have.
            Opera on the other hand might want to add some sort of hint as to where the “add word” item puts the word. “Add word to dictionary” or “Add to dictionary” isn’t really that long while being much better at describing the action taken.
            There’s also the issue with the context menu not being divided into sections, quite annoying I must say.

          • Andrew

            @Foo singing opera ;P
            Good news then.

            BTW I’ve read “Hooray for progers!” :-)

          • Flapper

            @Andrew: Epic fail again. You were busted with your extreme ignorance. Your were exposed lying about others, and now you are trying to change the subject.

            @Foo: The context was Opera’s inventions, whereupon some troll starts talking about spell checking, as if anyone claimed that Opera invented that. It isn’t everyone else’s fault that the obsessive anti-Opera trolls keep trying to change the subject.

          • Foo

            What did he lie about? I think he asked a very valid question. I must say I’m quite surprised in fact, that Opera for some reason still hasn’t updated their tutorial with something about it being fixed in a near future release…

            Nah, the context were (as said by TS, Blaze): “Oh yes, Opera is the best to introduce new features All the other browsers are catching up. That is why ONLY in version 10 it gets a spell checker(a basic feature for many other browsers)”

            and then blah came along with: “seriously? Opera had a spell checker since a long long time ago, and I can’t even remember for how long. It just did not underline errors like in a word processor.”

            and finally Andrew answered with: “It summarizes precisely why Opera sucks.”

            No one said anything about invention there, it’s all about lacking implementation.
            Are you perhaps reading too much into Blaze’s first sentence?

          • Flapper

            If you were busier reading instead of trolling, you would have read this:

            “Opera is the best to introduce new features”

            So people were talking about new features. Then some troll which is probably your (=nobody) sock puppet started whining about how Opera sucks because of a spell checker. Hilarious.

          • Foo

            The very thing I quoted in my comment which you seem to have completely misunderstood or are you just being an ass now?

            Perhaps you have some trouble understanding, but what he did were to start with something a lot of Opera fanboys use as a strange kind of “argument”.

            Oh yes, Opera is the best to introduce new features All the other browsers are catching up.

            Then he continued to note a couple of things that Opera didn’t get until recently.

            That is why ONLY in version 10 it gets a spell checker(a basic feature for many other browsers) and an proper update API so that finally users don’t have to download another full 7MB for every release(even for minor updates).

            Then blah commented about the spell-checker actually being there and the discussion in that thread/branch continued to be about the Opera spellchecker’s inferiority. Well, that and sort of what it implied about Opera as a browser too.
            Do you understand now, or is there something else unclear that I would have to explain to you?

            Yet again you come along with your personal attacks… seriously, can’t you spend the time you come up with slander on coming up with arguments or something to that effect?
            The closest I’ve been to having a sock puppet is my comment under the name “Foo singing opera ;P”, which I used because I used Opera at that moment (had just checked spell-checking) and thought it were a bit funny in a silly way.

          • Thoe

            So the guy mentions new stuff, and then starts contradicting himself by talking about spelling checkers. Awesome! This is how desperate the Opera bashers are…..

  • Bernie G

    So why do trolls like “nobody”, “Foo” and “Andrew” keep commenting on Opera all the time if they hate it so much?

    And why are they clearly being hypocritical, and holding the different browser vendors to different standards? Google has filed antitrust complaints against Microsoft and vice versa, but you don’t see these trolls bashing Google and Microsoft!

  • blaze

    Why does discussions like this always end up in what Opera can or cannot do? Opera is a good browser, but its not perfect. Although if you read the comments of the opera fan boys, you would be sure it is. This “Don’t say anything bad about opera or don’t accuse it of anything” attitude that is displayed around the web by them certainly does not help the image of Opera at all. And to crown it all, these guys are quick to call other people trolls.Opera could have had a better image with clear thinking fan boys. Pity, it is a good browser.

    • Flapper

      Actually, it’s Firefox fans that have the worst reputation. It has been covered in the press many times, like this one:

      http://www.informationweek.com/news/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=164301407&pgno=4&queryText=

      These discussions always end up this way not because of those defending Opera. It ends up this way because you have an obsessive troll with multiple accounts who keeps spewing his hatred and venom in every Opera article.

      • Foo

        2005? Things change as the years go by.

        • Thoe

          Evidently not in this case…..

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